Wireless Connect PLCs to the network

[jflick]

I was given this task to connect out PLCs to the network wirelessly so they can use the data that is on the machines.

I have ben given the company name HMS Anybus Bolt and Wireless access point. Has anyone used these? Will they work for this idea. If not what other ideas could be used to connect out PLC to the network to have access to the data being collected.

Would this be how it works;

Network ---- Access Point )))) Bolt ----PLC

 

[mylespetro]

I can't speak specifically to the Bolt, but you're essentially looking to create a wireless access point. There are many routers that will do this, the trick will be finding one that creates a strong enough signal to reach where it needs to reach. Essentially once you have a wireless access point, your computer connects to it the same as any other wifi network.

 

[VAN]

Why does it have to be wireless?

The bolt Ethernet RJ45E PoE might work, it's unclear if you use the two bolts and then the one side would be plugged into the network.

Just make sure it is "secure" as in wont take your production line down.

 

[jflick]

Why does it have to be wireless?

The bolt Ethernet RJ45E PoE might work, it's unclear if you use the two bolts and then the one side would be plugged into the network.

Just make sure it is "secure" as in wont take your production line down.

Those are the 2 things we are fighting right now is making sure that is secure. It doesn't have to be wireless but in the future it will make things easier not having to rerun cables every time a machine moves, our machines are mobile and move quite often.

 

[Nova5]

How often and how far do you move them around? You may want to look at setting up a wireless mesh style network with wired backhaul (aka hard line wiring to all APs).

Ubiquiti would be a low cost option for this. Its Prosumer grade, not quite industrial grade. But if you put them in some plastic nema boxes for protection you'll not have to much to worry about, their APs are POE. You can either power them from a multiport switch that has POE support or through their power injectors.

For each skid you would just need a wireless AP in bridge mode so it can hook into the Wireless network as a client device, bringing the skid's network devices online with it.

 

[jflick]

How often and how far do you move them around? You may want to look at setting up a wireless mesh style network with wired backhaul (aka hard line wiring to all APs).

Wouldn't if I did a wired backhaul it wouldn't make it a wireless mesh anymore. Having the wired backhaul defeats the purpose of the mesh network

 

[Nova5]

Wouldn't if I did a wired backhaul it wouldn't make it a wireless mesh anymore. Having the wired backhaul defeats the purpose of the mesh network

Easier to run CAT6 and power them over POE and hardens it against RF noise messing with the signal. Mesh also is a stretched term through alot of wireless gear. Its mixed between a wireless mesh where you set up a AP and just plug it into power, using the same hardware across your network's wireless gear and linking them together over radio. Or.. a unified control system for them that makes it look like they do the same thing.

I'd rather a wired backhaul setup in a noisy industrial environment. a true mesh thats wireless only is very dependent on the signal being reliable between the AP->AP and clients->AP. More signal space taken up by the AP-AP comms.

Wired backhaul also presents an alternative if the AP->AP link fails.

 

[OkiePC]

I inherited responsibility for a system using cheap Nanostation M2 radios that carry a mess of messages between Micrologix PLCs that are somewhat important for a water plant to operate properly and they have been pretty darned salty. Solid as a rock for 5 years, then lightning smoked one of them. I would not recommend them for machinery control and definitely not for implicit Ethernet/IP connections but for data collection they are probably the best value out there.

We recently (spring of 2020) added a pair of 5AC Loco radios to a site where we have Ignition talking to a Micrologix about a block away and it has performed flawlessly. The hardware to do this was under $250 including high quality outdoor CAT6 cables and a DIN rail mounted 24v powered POE injector for the remote station which needs to run on a battery backup system when the AC power is lost. Depending on how they're set up, your laptop wifi radio can connect with the controls LAN too.

I have not used them in a noisy indoor application, just hanging from water tanks and towers and mounted to the sides of chemical buildings. They are directional, but seem to work with a pretty wide path. Some of those we inherited are at 90 degrees of each other.

We have some for a wastewater lift station monitoring application where we have a HMI and Click PLCs all talking to each other over a couple of miles. That job required a rocketdish to reach through the trees to get to one particular lift station, but for that little low budget town it has been a great value.

That Anybus bolt looks like a better physical fit for indoor panel mounting and appears to be omnidirectional.

 

[Snyd1]

That Anybus bolt looks like a better physical fit for indoor panel mounting and appears to be omnidirectional.

I too have had good results with Ubiquiti in outdoor PTP/PTMP setups, way better than industrial radios like Prosoft:angr: and a fraction of the price.

I had looked into the Anybus Bolts in the past but the project never came to be so cannot speak about their reliability. If I remember correctly when we had them quoted they seemed fairly proud of their product...like close to 500$ per unit.

edit: as for security, I would discuss with IT department. I typically always try to hide SSID when available on the units, and do a white list for connections on top of the standard WPA w/e number.

 

[Dravik]

You also want to work w/ the IT dept to make sure they don't conflict w/ any existing wireless infrastructure.
If you're planning to use different APs, they may not mesh well w/ existing stuff.

 

[NetNathan]

Why does it have to be wireless?

The bolt Ethernet RJ45E PoE might work, it's unclear if you use the two bolts and then the one side would be plugged into the network.

Just make sure it is "secure" as in wont take your production line down.

Yes...
1 bolt at each end.
If you use PoE, it is a different PN for each bolt.

 

[NetNathan]

Weird... where did my 1st post go about the Bolt?

Oh... I see it was from a different thread.
https://www.plctalk.net/qanda/showthread.php?t=130273

 

[mad4x4]

Other good cost effective devices are :

https://www.4gon.co.uk/ubiquiti-unifi-uap-ac-mesh-access-point-p-6923.html?gclid=CjwKCAjw3_KIBhA2EiwAaAAlilhWfuKDO3uPybBHapXJRZEGM1f6ZoebE5iWZ5y-FRh2EPk-MrgNQhoCBZwQAvD_BwE

https://www.gl-inet.com/products/gl-mt300n-v2/

 

[James Mcquade]

if you are within 5 miles of any airport, there are restrictions you MUST adhere to, you are limited to certain frequencies. check your local area codes for th restrictions. i had to deal with that at a plant i worked at that was 1 mile from the local airport. we used ubiquity units. they worked great, but the heat in the summer got them when it got to 110. eventually went to fiber and life was good.
james

 

[OkiePC]

edit: as for security, I would discuss with IT department. I typically always try to hide SSID when available on the units, and do a white list for connections on top of the standard WPA w/e number.

Yes, that rings a bell. That is how we have ours set. I can set my laptop wifi to a static IP matching the controls LAN scheme and then connect to the radio and then to a PLC. This has been quite handy for a plant with a large campus and devices in areas where it is useful to monitor the HMI or logic while set up in a pipe gallery next to a valve or flow meter.